“It would be a huge benefit to us if mixed martial arts became an Olympic sport,” White said. “It would create instant awareness around the world, and it would be huge.

“I would support it 100 per cent. I personally am not out there trying to get mixed martial arts as an Olympic sport … but if it popped and they said, ‘Yes, we’re thinking about it,’ I would go guns ablazing and try to make it happen.”

I think it would be great to see MMA as an Olympic event. It would legitimize the sport while showing that the IOC cares about staying current and fresh. My concerns are that on such a big stage, people will certainly condemn the sport for being too violent, unless there are rule changes, which I would almost guarantee there would be if something like this was to happen. If MMA was to become a Olympic sport, but modified to IOC rules, I don’t see Dana White being as supportive then. What I would like to see in the meantime is some of the higher level fighters competing at their strongest discipline for their country. How cool would it be to see George St. Pierre suit up for Canada against the American, Jon Fitch in a pure wrestling match? Something like that would be great to watch and could still serve to legitimize the sport, since it would be obvious to people who think that UFC fighters are just brawlers, that these men are unbelievably skilled, trained athletes.

Please continue to post any questions or comments you may have and don’t forget to follow me on Twitter @zachlipari.

Dana White describes the new UFC Gym as not being a “fighters gym.” What he means by this is that people who might be interested in learning Muay Thai kick boxing but may be intimidated by going to a Muay Thai gym can feel comfortable learning at the UFC Gym, where they can learn with other people who are taking a more casual approach, as well. With an Octagon available for classes as well as more unconventional training such as the “caveman workout,” which involves truck tires and sledge hammers, this gym seems to have all of its bases covered for every commitment level. Also, where I think the gym will thrive is with its youth training section geared towards kids, which involves the technology to keep things interesting for them while learning martial arts and practicing fitness.

I happen to think this is a great business venture for the UFC from both a fan’s perspective as well as a business perspective. Capitalizing on a niche market in a multi-billion dollar per year industry isn’t always an option, and I think the UFC has done a great job recognizing the need for something like this. A spokesperson for the UFC has gone on record stating that they hope to open as many as 10 of these gyms nationwide in 2010 with possible locations in Toronto and Hawaii.

As I am writing this, I wonder if the NFL possibly missed out on an opportunity to throw its hat into the fitness industry. I think that the UFC is in a special place because while working out like a UFC fighter can sound pretty intense, starting at a beginner level is more interesting and useful towards fitness than anything else. It is hard for me to picture NFL combine training at anything less than full speed for people looking for a little bit of a change to their normal routines. The NFL, I suppose, is better suited with programs such as Play 60 which is geared towards children, or player-run football camps, but I do believe with the right business plan could possibly make a splash if they ever wanted to.

It will be interesting to monitor the success of this new venture and to see if it expands into other products such as health supplements or home workout equipment. For the moment though, I definitely like my neighborhood gym a lot less.

Check out a video of the UFC Gym here.

Please post any questions or comments you may have and don’t forget to follow me on Twitter @zachlipari

Once again, I have to believe that the UFC is ahead of the curve on this front. Fighters, in addition to working for the UFC, are their own brand and websites such as Twitter can help the fighter to directly grow their own personal iamge and receive more exposure. There are different, creative ways for a fighter to use Twitter and other social networking sites to actually make money for themselves. A fighter can tweet about their sponsor or hold sponsored contests through their Twitter account as an incentive for people to follow them and to pay attention, leading to increased value for the fans, the fighter, and the sponsoring company. UFC hall of famer and former champion, Chuck Liddell has even taken the next step and has developed MMAJacked.com a site specifically designed to connect Mixed Martial Arts fighters to their fans on a more personal level. Dana White frequently participates in “Twitter Tag,” an idea that was developed for Shaquille O’Neal by Digital Royalty that allows fans to find you in a public place such as a mall, or restaurant based on your tweets, usually for a prize, or in Dana White’s case, tickets to a UFC event. Georges St. Pierre’s Twitter account isn’t personally run by him, but his handlers had the idea to have fans e-mail Georges during his training by clicking a link that required you to sign up for his fan site before sending the e-mail, which ultimately attracted thousands of new fans.

The UFC is now more accessible than any other sports organization on a personal level. Everyone from the ring girls, to the announcers, to the fighters, to ownership all have highly personal Twitter accounts that are more than just company fluff and that actually give you insight into their lives and opinions which helps us, as fans, relate to them. As social media technology grows I am confident that the UFC will always be at the forefront and it will be interesting to see different business plans develop around these websites.

Please continue to post your comments and follow me on Twitter @zachlipari.

A few weeks ago, I wrote about how the UFC is planning on taking its product to a global market in far reaching countries such as the United Arab Emirates and Australia. The fact remains; however, that the UFC still can’t legally hold events in some of the states here in the United Sates. The biggest fight the UFC might face all year will take place outside of the octagon, and instead in Albany, NY where lobbyists and industry executives will try to persuade the Legislature to legalize the popular sport in New York State. This past week, the UFC was finally granted the approval to hold fights in Massachusetts; huge news for the company and northeastern United States MMA fans.

Massachusetts has become the 42nd state to legalize and regulate MMA, which will now fall under the Massachusetts State Athletic Commission. The bill was signed by Massachusetts Governor Deval Patrick this past week. UFC president Dana White updated his Twitter confirming the good news November 30, and was especially excited because Boston was where he grew up. White and the UFC are already planning events for 2010 and looking at Fenway Park or the TD Garden Arena as possible venues.

New York fans and the UFC alike are hopeful that 2010 will be the year for MMA regulation in the state. This year, the UFC has rethought its strategy and developed a pricey study that says hosting fights in Buffalo or Manhattan would produce millions of dollars for the cities at a time when the state’s economy is staggering under the weight of its current recession. The UFC has retained an influential lobbying firm and sent out its top executives to explain the sport to New York legislators.

Personally, being from New York City, I can not wait for MMA to come to New York. A UFC event at Madison Square Garden would be a tremendous fan experience and I believe would greatly benefit the state and the UFC financially. Boxing won’t bring their top fights to New York due to greed amongst fighters. The potential of a Floyd Mayweather/Manny Pacquiao fight would be a huge draw, but will never happen in New York due to state taxes that would cut too deeply into the fighters purses. Marquee UFC fighters such as Brock Lesnar or Georges St. Pierre would never question fighting on such an important card and the sport is better because of that. In the meantime, I will continue to monitor the events and hope to have good news in the near future regarding the subject.

Please continue to post your comments and follow me on Twitter @ZachLipari.

It is easy to make the argument that the UFC is the fastest rising sport in the country and possibly in the world. For someone who is looking to get into the sports industry, it could seem like a potential “gravy train” to financial success. With the landscape of potential major league clients diluted due to heavy competition, MMA may look like a nice alternative to leagues such as the NFL or MLB for prospective agents, managers, or companies. I decided to look a little deeper into the cash flow of a UFC fighter, and his potential to make money down the line.

Just like in major league sports, you have your stars and your role players, your rookies and your veterans. With the UFC; however, the gap is a little larger and the talent pool is a lot smaller. The UFC signs its fighters to contracts based on number of fights and not years like in major league sports. A rookie contract is greatly reduced from that of an established veteran, unlike football where a rookie can come in and be paid millions of dollars before stepping foot on a field. The contracts aren’t guaranteed, and if you find yourself in a losing slump, you will be looking to work elsewhere fast. For most fighters though, you get paid to show (fight) and you get paid to win. Usually the figures are the same to show and to win, so a loss could mean half of your potential purse for the fight. The UFC also offers fight bonuses as added incentives for their fighters. Fight bonuses are rewarded for the fight of the night, knockout of the night, and submission of the night and could be substantial to a fighter. It is the UFC’s way to sweeten the pot for a good fight.

After looking at salary figures from the last few Pay Per View events, it seems that the average fighter’s salary ranges from around $6,000 to $35,000 to show and to win, hardly a fraction of an NFL game check. Marquee fighters who have re-negotiated their rookie contracts earn in the lower six figure range, with the top level salary per fight that I have seen topping out at $500,000. Fight bonuses usually vary, but range between $50,000 to $70,000, a potential substantial bonus for someone in the lower pay range. A fighter could also be awarded multiple bonuses for a fight, which could make for a huge pay day. This past weekend, UFC Welterweight Josh Koscheck earned both fight of the night and submission of the night bonuses for his win over Anthony Johnson. Koscheck’s salary for the fight was $53,000 to show and $53,000 to win, and added to the $70,000 per bonus award, equaled a total of $246,000. Not bad for a night’s work, but hardly the norm.

It is safe to say that fighters make most of their money through endorsements. Companies pay good money to advertise their brand on a fighter through some sort of signage or apparel. I was curious to see how much fighters could potentially make through these kind of endorsements. After looking into it I found some numbers for Joe Lauzon, a ‘The Ultimate Fighter’ veteran and mid-level UFC fighter with not too much name cache’ but someone who was certainly going to be on T.V. The numbers are as follows:

• Team hat: $5,000
• Front of team shirt (entire front): $15,000
• Back of shirt:
  • Top banner (large font, across entire shirt): $1,000
  • Small banners (about 8 total): $500
• Fight Shorts:
  • Butt banner $5,000
  • Outside sides of thighs, front or back: $3,500 each (there’s 4)
  • Inside of thighs (4 available): $2,500

These numbers, when added up equal $54,000, which was likely more than Joe made for the entire fight. Remember this is for a mid-level fighter, so I would have to think that fighters such as Chuck Liddell and Brock Lesnar, etc are making in the six to seven figure range for their sponsorships in addition to their fight salary and potential bonuses. If you were someone who wanted to get into the business of MMA and represent fighters, it would be your job to secure these sponsors for your fighters, and would also most likely be your main source of revenue.

Fighters could also take these sponsorships, and with the help of a good manager, turn them into endorsement deals. Print ads, commercials, and online signage is a very profitable business and could be a great way to add increased revenue for your fighter. Also, endorsement deals are different from sponsorship deals in the sense that the UFC doesn’t ban their fighters from endorsing brands, but have recently put certain sponsors on their own little blacklist at UFC events. Brands who have challenged the UFC in some way, big or small, have found themselves on the outs with the UFC, and it can affect some fighters profoundly. The UFC can justify this by saying that in other promotions, the sponsorship dollars don’t even come close since the UFC is so popular. They feel that controlling sponsorships is perfectly justified. There was talk around UFC 100 that the UFC was going to charge potential sponsors $100,000 for the right to sponsor a fighter at the event because of the sheer magnitude of the night. Is this any different than the NFL charging millions of dollars for 30 second commercials during the Superbowl? That is to be debated, but is something to be considered if you are a company looking to get involved.

There is money to be made if you are a fighter or represent a fighter in the UFC. Compared to other professional sports organizations and boxing, the UFC still seems to be on the lower side of things as far as compensation for their athletes, but for a privately owned company who puts on and promotes their own events, it is reasonable for the moment. Still, some fights feature fighters who make $300,000 against fighters who are making $30,000, something I wouldn’t exactly call fair, especially when the $30,000 fighter wins. Such is life in the UFC at the moment, and one would think it is just going to get better as it gets bigger.

Please post any questions or comments and have a safe and happy Thanksgiving! Follow me on Twitter @Zachlipari

After a successful weekend in Manchester, England for UFC 105, the UFC will look to continue its growth around the world. In the last year, the UFC has traveled to Canada, England, and Germany, but plans to take the sport to countries such as Italy, France, Australia, and even Abu-Dhabi (the capital of the United Arab Emirates) in the near future. This a very smart and ambitious move for the UFC and could prove to be the groundwork for a global phenomenon years down the line.

This past weekend’s fights were received very positively by the U.K. fan-base; they see that the UFC has been growing steadily for the last few years. The sport of mixed martial arts was very new to the British fans when the UFC first came over, but a few short years later, it has become one of the more popular sports in the country with local stars such as Michael Bisping and Dan Hardy leading the way. Earlier this year, the UFC flagship program, “The Ultimate Fighter” featured a season where it matched up U.S. Fighters against U.K. Fighters, a first for the program. In the end, it was the U.K. who came out on top, showing the kind of effect that expanding globally can have on not only the bottom line as far as dollars for the UFC, but also on their roster of fighters and worldwide talent. UFC president Dana White summed up the road the UFC has traveled in England so far:

“I came here six or seven years ago to try and kick start mixed martial arts in the U.K.,” “When I came over here, nobody knew what it was. There really wasn’t any talent over here. In just six or seven years, we pack a stadium like this tonight.” (With 16,693 spectators packed into Manchester Evening News Arena, UFC 105 became the highest-attended European event in the history of the UFC. )

White also added:

“The other thing about tonight that blows me away is how educated the crowd was, how educated the fans here in the U.K. have become. When guys get side-control and the guy gets back in full-guard, they start cheering. They’re very educated in the ground game. They’re very educated on the fights. It’s amazing how fast this country has come around.”

The UFC will look to bring its brand of fighting to other countries the same way it introduced it here in the United States. Through its reality show, The Ultimate Fighter, the UFC will put on regional versions of the show and is actively trying to work out T.V. deals that will put the UFC into millions of new homes.

“My job is over the next 10 years, the same game of soccer that we play in the U.S. is the same game they play in Canada, Mexico, Spain, Italy, France, etc., and that’s what we’re doing with mixed martial arts right now,” White said. “Everywhere you go all over the world, it’s the same sport, and everybody plays by the same rules. We’re trying to get these television deals in all these countries, major TV deals exposing the fans to it, then you bring a live event to those places. Then the virus spreads and people start training at it, trying to make a living at it, eventually becoming professional athletes. That’s what we’re going to do over the next 10 years.”

“How do we plug this whole thing in with television and how to watch it everywhere? We’re trying to figure that whole thing out and build that now. But the groundwork for this thing is ‘The Ultimate Fighter,’ and we’ve been working it very hard, and we’re making it happen. ‘The Ultimate Fighter’ is going to be all over the world. That’s the goal.”

The list of possible regions for the UFC to explore is endless, as martial arts and fighting in some form, is kind of a universal language. Expansion hasn’t been totally problem free, however. White, and the UFC have faced challenges in the past when trying to come into a new market or country. When they went to Germany for the first time earlier this year, they were received well by fans, but country officials were deeming the sport too brutal or dangerous and opposed what the UFC was trying to do. This stigma that the UFC carries is mainly from its beginnings as a no-holds-barred fight sport in the early 1990’s before White ever stepped foot into the company and changed it from top to bottom. I think this is really the only thing that could slow down the UFC’s quest to enter new markets as some local government officials could try to ban it, but the UFC has a team of public relations experts that I would have to believe is up to the task. I think that White is the kind of person who won’t rest until his company’s goals are accomplished, and that 10 years from now, we will see unprecedented growth from this sport internationally.

One last quote from Dana White, because as you start to follow the UFC, you will see that he comes up with some interesting (to say the least) things to say.

“Randy Couture fought in the U.K. tonight and got a [expletive] standing ovation. People went crazy for this American. You don’t ever see that [expletive], and you haven’t seen that since the Mike Tyson days. People are feeling that way all over the world about lots of guys, whether it’s Wanderlei Silva, Anderson Silva, the guys from the U.K., a Canadian. [Expletive Georges St- Pierre] is going to fight Dan Hardy. ‘GSP’ got a warm ovation from the crowd. You don’t see that [expletive] in any other sport. So, there’s a lot of potential globally here to do some cool [ expletive].”

Please continue to post your comments or any questions you may have.

Sports Business

• A job very well done by Red Bull [Red Bull's Project X = Sports Marketing Idea of the Year].
• Maybe not the world just yet, but starting off at the high school level is a good strategy [Can Under Armour, IMG Take the World By Storm?].
• St-Pierre t0 serve as the face of Under Armour’s Underwear [Under Armour signs UFC champ Georges St-Pierre to multi-year endorsement deal].
• I actually just yesterday had this discussion with somebody [End of the Day, Live Events Make Sports, Brands, King…].

Baseball

• A little baseball trademark law conversation [Wide world of ‘Series’].

Football

• No sense of urgency on the part of the owners [League rejects "lock-in" bargaining proposal].
• A two-paragraph statement that included no explanation – bothers me [Bryant loses final appeal].

Basketball

• BJ Armstrong answers a few questions while promoting the launch of Windows 7 [An Interview with BJ Armstrong].

This is the fourth interview in an on-going series by Gary Wimsett, Jr., lawyer and MMA enthusiast, about the business of Mixed Martial Arts.  In Part I, Gary spoke with Sports Illustrated Senior Contributor, L. Jon Wertheim, about his new book, “Blood in the Cage” about the history of MMA, the career of Pat Miletich, and the rise of the UFC.  In Part II, Gary and Sam Sheridan, author of “A Fighter’s Heart” engaged in a Q & A regarding Sam’s insights into the fighting world as a writer and fighter. In Part III, Gary talked to Pat Miletich about WAMMA, the UFC, and unionization.  In this interview, Gary speaks with Ken Pavia of MMA Agents about what life is like for one of the sport’s busiest men.  Ken answered these questions while in Montreal for UFC 97.  Gary exchanged e-mails with Ken before – from Finland, Japan, and points all over the globe, but rarely from Ken’s home in California

Wimsett: When/Why did you start MMA Agents?  What were you doing before and what was it about the industry that appealed to you?  Do you exclusively represent MMA fighters or do you have other sports clients?

Pavia: I purchased UFC 1 and became a fan.  I was introduced to Ricco Rodriguez soon after he lost to Nog in Japan and he approached me for representation.  I was a baseball and hockey agent for 12 years prior.  I now only represent MMA fighters.

Wimsett: How many fighters do you represent?  Who are your top guys?  Do you represent women fighters?

Pavia: I represent 55 fighters.  One female.  Erin Toughill.  They are all top guys…

Wimsett: Do you oversee/coordinate your fighters’ training schedules and programs?

Pavia: I leave the training to the professionals.  I seek business opportunities for my clients.  They choose which fights to take.

Wimsett: How many different promotions do you work with?  Which one is the easiest to work with?  What kind of services are you able to provide to a fighter under a UFC contract?

Pavia: In 2007 we sent fighters to 32 promotions in 8 countries.  In 2008 we sent them to 35 promotions in 8 counties.  We will blow those numbers away this year.  We provide compliance support, media support, travel support, sponsorships, PR, legal, appearances and seminars, and fight procurement.

Wimsett: Who are some of the biggest sponsors in the industry?  How do you ensure them a return on their investment?  How has the slumping economy affected sponsorship and/or endorsement deals you get for your fighters?

Pavia: TapouT is an industry leader.  This question is best answered by the sponsorship department.

Wimsett: Where do you see the UFC in five years?  Still the ”King of the Mountain” or will there be some other large-scale promotion competing for PPV dollars?

Pavia: Really your guess is as good as mine.  I will say they have a significant head start.

Wimsett: Describe a typical workday for you.  Do you travel a lot?

Pavia: I travel 7 out of 8 weekends.  I get up about 9 or 10 and just break to eat and continue to work until generally 3 or 4 AM, 7 days a week.  I will never be out worked.

Wimsett: Other than your law degree, do you have any other certifications or licenses?  Anything really necessary?

Pavia: I was certified to represent athletes by the player associations of the NFL, NBA, MLB, and NHL.

Wimsett: Where is MMA Agents headquartered?

Pavia: We are based out of Huntington Beach with affiliate offices in Korea, London and Paris.

Wimsett: Do you feel you have to be in or around Las Vegas or be able to travel there regularly to make your business work?

Pavia: I get there enough and with my blackberry, I am global.  I represent about 8 fighters out of Vegas.

Wimsett: Do you have an East Coast operation?

Pavia: No I do not.

Wimsett: Thoughts on WAMMA?  A Fighter’s Association?

Pavia: Don’t really know much about them.  But will say I really like Mike Lynch.

Wimsett: What MMA websites do you stay up to date on?  How do you stay informed about what’s happening in this ever-changing industry?

Pavia: Junkie, Sherdog, Weekly, MMA.tv, Facebook, and Myspace are always open on my computer.  I also peek at CBSsportsline and USAtoday.

Wimsett: As a fan, what MMA matchup would you most like to see right now?

Pavia: Tito v Babalu, Radach v Lawler, Vitor v Anderson, Riggs v Shields or Diaz, Baroni v Davis or Diaz, Cyrille v Houston or Irvin, Hieron v Goat, AJ v Howard or Alves, Pyle v Condit, and Kampman v Swick.

Wimsett: How many employees do you have?  How do you recruit and hire?  Do you have an internship program?

Pavia: We have 5 employees and 5 interns, and one full time consultant.  We do have an intern program and usually take law students.

Wimsett: Who is your biggest competition?

Pavia: Ourself.  We are first and second best.

Wimsett: Who do you look up to in the sports business?  Role models?

Pavia: I admire Drew Rosenhaus and Lee Steinberg.  I admire Jim Rome and Tommy Lasorda.

Wimsett: What’s the most important skill/attribute of an effective MMA agent?

Pavia: Personality, ice in veins, ability to be rational not emotional, and ability to solve problems.  Thick skin too…

Wimsett: Are you actively recruiting college wrestlers?  How do you recruit clients?

Pavia: No we are not.  We only sign fighters that have experienced a significant amount of success at a local circuit and are ready for major shows.

Wimsett: What do you do to get away from the chaos?  When was your last vacation?

Pavia: I haven’t had a real break in three plus years,  I don’t get away from the chaos.  It defines me.

This is the third interview in an on-going series by Gary Wimsett, Jr., lawyer and MMA enthusiast, about the business of Mixed Martial Arts.  In Part I, Gary spoke with Sports Illustrated Senior Contributor, L. Jon Wertheim, about his new book, “Blood in the Cage” about the history of MMA, the career of Pat Miletich, and the rise of the UFC.  In Part II, Gary and Sam Sheridan, author of “A Fighter’s Heart” engaged in a Q & A regarding Sam’s insights into the fighting world as a writer and fighter. In this interview, Gary speaks with MMA fighting legend, Pat Miletich, about Pat’s new project, WAMMA, and other provocative issues swirling around the business of MMA in 2009.  Stay tuned for additional installments.

On February 5, 2009, I had the opportunity to talk to Pat Miletich about MMA generally, WAMMA, and the business side of the sport.  The following is a transcription of our telephone conversation.  It has been edited for readability.

Wimsett:  I would like to start by acknowledging the passing of Helio Gracie, one of the sport’s true legends.  Did you ever have an opportunity to meet Helio?

Miletich:  I did – and it was an honor.  Here’s a guy who was a true visionary.  He understood jiu jitsu on such a high level.  He dissected it and constantly refined it.  He showed the world how a little man could beat a big man and he changed the fight game in a very significant way.

Wimsett:  We’re a month into 2009 – what’s WAMMA’s priority this year?

Miletich:  Gary, the main thing is this – to make sure the highest ranked guys get to fight each other for an undisputed world title belt.  It’s that simple.  Of course, we want to continue to educate the fans about the importance of having an undisputed world title belt.  Look, a lot of organizations have belts, and that’s fine.  But MMA needs an undisputed belt.  People need to understand that being an organizational champion in no way, shape or form makes you the undisputed world champion.  It’s very important for fans to understand that.  The athletes need to understand this, too.  It’s to everyone’s benefit.

Wimsett: Maybe not everyone’s.  My sense is that the fans understand what WAMMA wants to do and they get the idea of an undisputed champion.  It’s the UFC that needs convincing.

Miletich:  Anyone with one eye and half a brain can see why the UFC’s not interested in a unified belt.  It dilutes their brand.  The UFC has a lot of the best MMA fighters, but they do not have all of them.  They know the WAMMA belt represents something bigger than an organizational belt.  Some of the number one, two and three guys don’t fight in the UFC.  Those guys deserve the right to fight for the world championship.  Just as the UFC fighters deserve the right to fight for an undisputed belt.  Look at Fedor [Emelianenko] for example.  He’s ranked #1 in the world.  The UFC has the 4^th or 5^th ranked guy.  I’m sure Brock Lesnar or Frank Mir would like to fight Fedor for the championship but obviously the UFC’s not letting that happen right now.  As a fighter, if I’m not the #1 guy in the world – I at least want a shot at it.

Wimsett:  If Zuffa [UFC's parent company] doesn’t get on board, what can WAMMA do?

Miletich:  The fans are starting to embrace the idea of a WAMMA belt.  The fans love the Affliction shows and some of the great shows put on by the other promotions. Scott Coker’s an incredible promoter. Monte Cox’s Adrenaline is picking up speed.  The Japanese promotions have high-level fighters.  It’s starting to dawn on people that the UFC does not have all the best fighters in the world.  They have a lot of them.  But they don’t have all of them.  As we see more television exposure for these other promotions, the voice of the fans will grow stronger and the UFC will have to answer.  We believe it is just a matter of time.

Wimsett:  WAMMA’s now in its second year.  What’s its biggest achievement to date?

Miletich:  We’re working very hard on simply building relationships with all the existing promotions.  We’re proud of the work we’re doing in that area.  We’ve traveled the country explaining WAMMA to the media, to promoters, to fighters.  It’s an ongoing education campaign but we’re proud of how far we’ve come.

Wimsett:  I know that one of WAMMA’s stated goals is fortifying MMA’s legitimacy.  I’m curious – does the emergence of a former WWE champion [Brock Lesnar] compromise MMA’s legitimacy at all.

Miletich:  Not at all.  People need to understand, and I think they do, that most WWE athletes are great athletes.  Brock Lesnar was a Division I national champion wrestler.  That doesn’t happen by accident.  He’s a tremendous athlete.

Wimsett:  Do you anticipate any major rule changes in MMA.  For example, Sam Sheridan, your friend, and author of “A Fighter’s Heart” predicted the possible return to glove-less fighting?

Miletich:  They are doing that in Brazil, I think.  But, I don’t see it as a smart move.  Guys are going to shatter their hands.  Some of the early fighting contests started that way in order to prove which martial art was the best – the Gracie’s set out to do that and they did a great job.  But the guys have become so well-rounded and are so good at striking and stopping take downs and inflicting heavy blows on each other that you’d have careers come to a screeching halt because guys will start shattering their hands.  In a street fight where you have to defend yourself and possibly save your life you are going to go ahead and punch people.  But when you make your living and feed your family with your hands, the longevity of your career is very important.  I don’t see that as something that takes off and does well.

Wimsett:  Do you anticipate any major rule changes?

Miletich:  I really don’t.  The guys that have worked on the rules in their current form, they’ve worked hard and they knew what they were doing.  The guys in New Jersey who helped write the rules and put in the weight classes, they’ve done good work.  John Peretti – the original matchmaker for the UFC, and Nick Lembo, they’ve been instrumental in writing these rules.

Wimsett:  Let’s talk about WAMMA and fighter pensions.

Miletich:  Again, the main goal right now is to make sure the athletes have the opportunity to fight for the undisputed world title.  We want the athletes to make the proper amount of money because of those fights and we want cross-promotion bouts.  Those are our priorities at WAMMA.  Fighter pensions – that’s a goal.  But, as you know, there are a lot of people talking about forming a fighter’s union and that’s something we would hand off to a fighter’s union when and if that comes to pass.  Some people think a union is around the corner, some people think it’s further down the road.  We’ll see.  These kinds of issues will likely fall to those people forming the union.  Health insurance is another thing.  There are a lot of things that need to happen on behalf of the athletes.  They need help.  They need to not sign their rights away for a lifetime.  It’s wrong.  The 360 deals the UFC talk about – I think they’re illegal.  They restrict people from being able to make money.  I think they’re going to run into some serious legal problems.

Wimsett: I know a lot of people hope those 360 deals don’t happen.

Miletich:  Let’s just say this.  If fighters sign those contracts, you know the union attorneys will be filing a class action lawsuit.

Wimsett:  To be clear, WAMMA wants to work with a fighter’s union?  Not be a fighter’s union?

Miletich:  We’d work very closely with a fighter’s union.  We’re for a lot of the same things that a union would be for.  And it basically boils down to fighter’s rights.  We want to help the fighters and the fans.  And in the end, the promoters are going to make a lot more money, too.

Wimsett: Is there a particular group that WAMMA is looking at as far as a union partner?

Miletich:  I have not been contacted by anyone yet regarding a union but I expect the calls will be coming soon.

Wimsett:  Let’s talk about the quality of the officiating in MMA right now.

Miletich:  Some of it is very good and some of it is very bad.  Obviously I’m not going to name names.  I think as a rule, the guys that compete in the sport are better at officiating than guys that don’t.  This sport is so much more complex than boxing, you have to know when a submission is going to be put on somebody, you have to know when it’s coming so you are prepared to stop the fight when someone’s in trouble.  You have to understand when someone’s unconscious – even when the fighter’s eyes are open.  I’ve seen guys who were unconscious being choked because the referee didn’t know the guy was unconscious. Little things like that.  It’s the same with judging.  We’ve seen some bad decisions, sure.  Just like in boxing.  And it comes from the fact that you’ve got guys judging who have never competed in the sport.  People think, for example, when they see a bad decision in boxing that something dirty is going on but I’ve got to tell you, more often than not, it’s because the judges are just in over their heads.  They’re contractors or doctors and they’re judging on the weekends.  You’re going to get some bad decisions.  MMA – man, then you are really scrambling their brains when they’re trying to figure out what’s going on in the cage.

Wimsett:  Is this an area WAMMA would like to address organizationally?

Miletich:  In the end, it’s really up to the various athletic commissions in the states and some of them are great at it.  Some are not.  There needs to be some sort of baseline.  These refs and judges are holding kids futures and careers in their hands.  It’s a big thing.  For me personally and the company also, so yes, it’s something we’re looking at.

Wimsett: I know you’re not interested in naming names but is there a referee out there doing a particularly good job you’d like to mention?

Miletich:  John McCarthy is probably the best out there.  Yves Lavigne is very good.  Herb Dean’s gotten a lot better over the years with his experience.  Those are just some and there are others.

Wimsett:  Tell me about the Ranking Board?

Miletich:  We’ve got 30 members on the ranking board right now and they are the very best media guys in MMA in the business.  Sam Kaplan chairs that committee.  WAMMA is not a part of it.  It’s separate.  It’s the best system we could come up with and we think those guys are doing a great job.  We think it’s a safe system and it’d be foolish for anyone to try to get a hold of those guys and try to sway their opinions.  Who’s going to pay-off 30 ranking board members?

Wimsett:  Let’s talk about your business partners.

Miletich:  We do a lot of conference calls.  Fred Levin’s involved with giving his input and guiding the organization.  Mike Lynch is obviously another very smart guy who is very involved.  With Dave [Szady] being the CEO and President, former FBI/CIA official, he’s a guy whose integrity cannot be called into question.  We want to be straight up.  Lynch knows about every fighter on the planet and they’re all class acts.  We’ve all become very good friends and I enjoy being in business with them.

Wimsett: Fedor’s next fight?

Miletich:  Josh Barnett.  That’s a huge fight.  Right now, they are the two best heavyweights on the planet without a doubt.

Wimsett:  Who’s the best non-heavyweight fighter in the world right now?

Miletich:  George St. Pierre comes to mind.  Anderson Silva is another one.  I’ve known those guys for a lot of years.  I think that Rob Lawler is going to sneak up on a lot of people.  I don’t think people realize how good Rob’s gotten.  I don’t care who you are, if you get hit by Rob, you are going to sleep.  He’s a guy who I really think could be the best pound for pound guy on the planet.

Wimsett:  Who’s the toughest guy you’ve out at the gym in Bettendorf?

Miletich:  That’s a tough question.  Over the years we’ve had the best of the best come through.  I think we’ve had over 85 guys on Pay Per View shows, something like 14 organizational champions.  I couldn’t narrow it down.

Wimsett:  Proudest moment as a fighter?

Miletich:  Holding the title for 3 and a half years – probably.  Coming back after having such a tough time healing up my neck after 4 or 5 years.  That was pretty big accomplishment.

Wimsett:  What’s the most surprising thing you’ve learned about yourself through fighting?

Miletich:  It’s a huge growth process when you climb in the ring.  You are naked to the world and you have no excuses.  You have to go out there and be the man or get beat up.  I was a kid that came from a little bit of a rough background.  My dad wasn’t always the nicest guy.  There’s a lot of guys out there like that and they use that as a crutch.  But, it’s no excuse to be a jerk in life.  Fighting makes me a better person and helps me deal with my own issues and my demons and you realize it’s not that hard to treat people well.  It’s a growth experience for sure.

Wimsett: That’s one of the things I really like about the sport is that after the bout you see that mutual respect the fighters have for each other and that’s very compelling and noble.

Miletich:  Absolutely.  There is no animosity among fighters.  For the most part.

Wimsett:  Talk about the difference between training and fighting.

Miletich:  Training can be intense.  But, when you step into the ring for a fight and the crowd’s there and the lights are shining down . . . there’s nothing like that adrenaline rush.  Your senses are all at their peak.  And when you start the fight, and for your first few fights, everything is a blur – it’s chaos.  It’s an amazing sensation.  But after a while, the fight starts to slow down and when you go back and watch the fight it’s like watching it in fast motion again.  It’s very strange.  But once you’ve been in a few fights, things slow down and you start to see things, sense and understand and anticipate things.

Wimsett:  What would you tell to up and coming fighters in terms of mastering a particular fighting style to get a strong foundation.

Miletich:  Wrestling.  Wrestlers have heart.  Strong tendons, good balance.  Incredible strength.  The hardest part is teaching them the rhythm of stand up.  But if they can get that, I’ll take a wrestler any day.  Good work ethic.  Endurance.  It’s tough to find that anywhere else.

Wimsett:  What do you think about all the karate dojos advertising “MMA classes” now?

Miletich:  It’s kind of funny.  It wasn’t that long ago when those guys were telling their students, you can’t go fight MMA, these moves are designed to kill.  I find that amusing.  But in the long run, it’s probably good.  It brings more exposure to the sport.  Ultimately, WAMMA and state athletic commissions will need to look at what these dojos are doing and whether there needs to be more regulation so guys don’t get hurt.

Wimsett: WAMMA’s obviously been reaching out to a lot of promotions.  What’s the best small promotion that most MMA fans haven’t heard of?

Miletich:  Extreme Challenge.  It’s the oldest besides the original UFC owners.  Monte Cox runs that.  He’s been my manager for my entire career and he and I got into the sport together.  And he puts on great shows.

Wimsett: How did Jon Wertheim [author of "Blood in the Cage"] get out of Bettendorf without getting slapped around especially after Sam Sheridan took so much punishment?

Miletich:  You know, some guys are writers and some guys are fighters.  Sam came over to get the fight experience.  Jon’s goals were different.  They’re both great guys and I think Jon’s book is really good and I hear it’s been getting good reviews.  Sam’s a great guy.  I wish we were neighbors.  He’s got a great sense of humor and he’s just a lot of fun to be around.

Wimsett:  What are your thoughts on sports agents entering the MMA space?

Miletich:  The innocence of the sport is gone.  But, agents are the guys that have the connections to the big sponsor dollars and they’ve negotiated really large contracts so that’s a good thing to have on your side.

Wimsett: Take “fighter X”, in the middle of the pack, does he need an agent?

Miletich:  Everyone needs some sort of representation so they don’t get taken advantage of.  You need someone who knows what to look for in contracts.  Some of these guys have the Nike, Adidas contacts.  They can bring more money to the table.

Wimsett: Have you seen the new UFC-branded gyms?  Your thoughts.

Miletich:  Smart business idea by the UFC.  The quality of instruction remains to be seen inside of them.  This is a sport where bigger is probably not better.  If you can find a hole in the wall gym and learn from a guy who really knows his stuff – that’s a better training environment.  But I don’t think those are the guys these branded gyms are really looking for anyway.  I think they’re mostly looking for the kids and housewives who just want to get in shape.

Wimsett: What’s the best place for up and coming fighters to train in the United States?

Miletich:  Anywhere where they have a lot of good, experienced fighters.  No specific places necessarily.  Somewhere with a proven track record of putting out great fighters.

Wimsett:  How’s WAMMA going to make money? What’s your revenue stream?

Miletich:  It comes down to, you know when you watch all the bowl games on TV, and you see the FedEx Sugarbowl for example, the WAMMA belt will be co-branded with sponsors so it’ll be the, for example, the Gatorade/WAMMA heavyweight world title.  That’s the model.

Wimsett:  Pat, it’s been a pleasure speaking with you this afternoon.

Miletich:  Sure thing, Gary.  No problem.  I enjoyed it.

Let’s all agree on one thing. Brock Lesnar is a gifted athlete, with an incredible wrestling background. However, he did not use his wrestling skills to defeat Randy Couture, which means what? This guy is evolving into a better fighter every time he steps into the Octagon. Another notable reason he defeated Randy is quite simple: He was too big for Randy to toss around. There were a few attempts by Couture to take Lesnar to the mat, with single leg takedowns, but the attempts were futile. Lesnar’s take down defense prevented that from happening. Besides, if you know someone can match your wrestling skills toe-to-toe, why take it to the ground? Not to mention, if Couture would have gotten Lesnar on the ground, it would have not been that difficult for Couture to possibly submit him.

Another point to make is that Randy came in too light for this fight. He should have packed on an additional 10 pounds. Giving up 65lbs is one thing, but to give up 76lbs to your opponent is another.

Not to discredit Couture, here is what he had in his favor: Conditioning. It was very noticeable in round 2 that Lesnar was starting to get worn down. Had Randy been able to stay on the proverbial path of ‘stick and move’, he would have been able to wear Lesnar down, which could have resulted in either a knockout or the fight going to the ground. Experience. Randy has over 25 fights under his belt, not to mention countless fights as an amateur. His game plan was well thought out, but ineffective against the bigger and stronger Lesnar. Nonetheless, to his acknowledgment, he came in prepared for victory. Crowd Support. Everyone knows in Las Vegas that Randy’s town. Brock was booed at the weigh ins and during the introductions. Getting the crowd behind you can be a tremendous help, but once the balance of power starts to swing, the crowd faded.

Bottom line is this: Brock Lesnar was the biggest and strongest opponent Randy Couture has fought. Couture put up a valiant effort, but when it is all said and done, Brock Lesnar’s hand was held high as the new heavyweight champion. A question to consider: What is in store for Randy Couture? Whether it is retirement or another battle in the Octagon, whatever the choice, we all must tip our hat to The Natural Randy Couture.

Guest contribution by Warren Jackson, Co-Founder of Mayhem365 Sports Marketing